Carol Fishman Cohen: Welcome to 3,2,1 iRelaunch, the podcast where we discuss strategies, advice, and success stories about returning to work after a career break. I'm Carol Fishman Cohen, CEO, and co-founder of iRelaunch and your host today. We welcome Robin Gorman Newman. Robin is the founder of RGN Marketing, where she is a specialist in marketing communications and public relations.

She has also authored two books and is a Tony award-nominated producer. She is the founder of Motherhood Later Than Sooner, a worldwide organization whose mission is to support, connect and empower later-in-life mothers and fathers. And she's also the founder of LoveCoach.com, which we'll discuss. We'll discuss how adopting a child later in life impacted her life and career path and how her interest in theater evolved into her work as a Broadway producer. We're also going to get her views on what the theater world will look like post pandemic.

Robin, welcome to 3,2,1 iRelaunch.

Robin Gorman Newman: Good to be here. Thank you so much for hosting me.

Carol Fishman Cohen: You have such an unusual and varied career path, and I'm really interested in hearing how all of that happened and came together. But let's first start a little earlier on, you had a long career in PR and then wrote a book called How to Meet a Mensch in New York and a second book, How to Marry a Mensch.

And I want to start when you and your husband adopted your son when you were 42 years old. Did you take a career break then?

Robin Gorman Newman: No, I did not. I would just say that it was a shift. Prior to that I was working for a PR firm, I was a VP there for a number of years. And then when the first book came out, How to Meet a Mensch in New York, surprising to me, I wound up on TV all over the world. I was on the Today Show, CNN, and the London media embraced it. I did not see that coming at all. I started doing speaking gigs, and then I eventually launched a business as a love coach. That led to my second book, the How to Marry a Mensch title, because it seems crazy to be getting all this media and have a book that was for the tri-state, which was the initial book, it was like a Zagat's guide. So, from all of that and from my love-coaching work and having the background in PR, when my husband and I were working toward parenthood, and eventually that happened, as you said, at age 42, I had made the choice to work for myself and to work from home.

And that allowed me a lot of flexibility with the various projects and hats that I was wearing. And that ultimately led to some of the other things that we're going to talk about.

Carol Fishman Cohen: And I do want to talk about that now because the other theme is that you got into theater and then later got into the producing side of theater, and I wanted to know if you can tell us how that happened.

Robin Gorman Newman: Sure. First of all, I'm a lifelong theater lover. I grew up with it and my mom loved it. It wasn't something that I necessarily thought would be a career. But when I went to undergraduate school at Hofstra University, I was actually the arts editor of a school newspaper.

I did feel at that time that I wanted to be a theater critic. I was doing a lot of writing for the newspaper and also other outlets. But then when Frank Rich got hired by the New York Times and he was the lead critic then, I felt like he took my job. So I was dismayed, which was a little funny, because I certainly could have pursued other jobs, but that was my mindset at that time.

So I went on from there and just worked in other industries, and then eventually circled back to theater actually through my motherhood work, because when I launched motherhoodlater.com for a while there, there was a trend in theater where a lot of mom shows were happening. And around that, a lot of the theatrical marketing and PR and social media firms were then targeting that audience, not just moms, but women over 40, because that's the sweet spot for ticket buyers.

And that's largely my audience of women who became a mom for the first time were again over 35, but it's really more over 40. So I started working with a lot of the marketing firms on a promotional level to help various shows on and off Broadway to reach my audience and beyond. From that, a show came on my radar which was in California and it was called In Mother Words.

It was one of those universe moments, Carol, where, and this is a lesson I'd love to share with your listeners, that if your gut tells you to do something, just to do it. Because one phone call can change your whole path. And that's exactly what happened for me. When I heard about the show in California, I just decided to call the theater.

It was at the Geffen and it wasn't even playing anymore. And I honestly have no idea why I called, or what my agenda was. I think I left this cryptic message for the producers just saying “hi,” essentially, and feeling like they're never going to call me back. Because when you leave a message in a box office, it falls into a black hole.

So I moved on to other things I was working on, and a few weeks later the producer called me. We had the most lovely conversation. I was completely blindsided, and because of my background in PR and marketing and also the mom's space and my love of theater, they were very interested in some kind of relationship with me. And unbeknownst to me, the show was coming to New York.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Wow. Amazing how all of that came together. I think about all the themes in your life and in that one sentence, you said it sounded like it came together right there.

Robin Gorman Newman: Exactly. And then I wound up getting invited on as an associate producer for the New York production, and they sent me this script. I had never produced before. I didn't plan on that per se. And I remember when the script came in and I was reading it, I said to my husband, "They invited me on the show and I feel like I need to do it." And he said, "Okay." So I just dove in, and because it was a smaller show, it was off-Broadway, it also gave me an opportunity to really dig my heels in.

They allowed me to help on the marketing end and to be part of special events around it. So it really gave me not just entree as a producer in the theater world, but also with it a chance to put all my skills together for the good of a show. And it was really the perfect synergy.

Carol Fishman Cohen: That's super interesting and an amazing way to learn. And let me just ask you, do you have control of your schedule when this is happening or do these shows just come in like a whirlwind and you have to keep up with them?

Robin Gorman Newman: You mean when a show is at a theater or when you're looking at projects to get involved with?

Carol Fishman Cohen: For example, when the Motherhood Out Loud show, I guess it was In Mother Words originally and then it changed into Motherhood Out Loud, when it came to New York and you were the associate producer, did you have a lot of schedule control while that was all happening or was it crazy?

Robin Gorman Newman: It depends on the timeframe. This was a little fast and furious because when it was coming to New York, it wasn't like it was coming in a year, six months, it was coming fairly quickly. So that was definitely time consuming and they wanted to do some special events around it, like mom theater blogger nights and things like that.

So I jumped in head first, really fast. And then when the show was actually at a theater, I was there almost every night. You don't have to be necessarily, even as a lead producer, you'd want to be, but I was an associate producer, and I wanted to be there, it was so exciting. What was so cool was that my son was young then, he had just turned eighteen. And he saw I was out all the time and he'd say, "Mom, where are you going?" And I'd say, "I have a show." And even at his young age, he said, "Can I come see it?" And it was the coolest thing. That's one of the things I feel so blessed around all the work that I do, that my son has been raised loving theater as well, and it's something that we share and it really touches my heart. He wanted to support me as a mom and be there for this project. It's so amazing when your worlds can meet that way.

Carol Fishman Cohen: And then from there you went on to invest in a couple of Broadway shows, Sylvia and Godspell, pretty big time shows. How does that happen? And how does that work?

Robin Gorman Newman: When I was on Motherhood Out Loud, once you are in the industry, people get a sense that, "Oh, here's some new blood who might be ripe for the picking and maybe she'd want to get involved with something else." Sylvia was actually a show that I had heard was coming to Broadway, and I loved it. It had been off-Broadway if you recall a number of years ago with Sarah Jessica Parker, and it stuck in my mind. When I heard it was coming to Broadway with Matthew Broderick and Annaleigh Ashford, and I happen to love Annaleigh Ashford, I just decided to reach out to this producer who I happened to know through the producer on Motherhood Out Loud, and I said, "I just love the show off-Broadway and is there some opportunity to get involved?" And so I wound up coming on as an investor for that. Godspell came because it was another lead producer who I had connected with. The interesting thing with theater is that once you're in the industry, whether as a producer or an investor, but certainly as an investor, because most producers start out that way, if you make an effort to network and mingle and immerse yourself, which I did, you will start to meet people and that's when things happen. People wonder, how do you get involved in the industry? And it's because you put yourself in there and you've made this decision that you want to get involved and you want to be part of the community.

Carol Fishman Cohen: What you're saying is really a fundamental piece of in almost any field, there’s this networking piece and the personal relationships and the personal handoffs. So when you say networking in the theater industry, obviously you were deep into it in the associate producer role for Motherhood Out Loud, and that I guess was the “in” and you started meeting other people. But do you meet them at parties? Do you go to openings? This is of course all pre-COVID, let's be clear about that. But where do you actually interact with people who, for example, like the Sylvia people or the Godspell people, where do you meet them?

Robin Gorman Newman: Facebook is one possibility. There's a lot of theater groups on Facebook. There's a lot of theater people on Facebook. I actually have a Facebook group with many theater colleagues there, it's called Lifelong Theatre Lovers and Supporters, that's a great place to connect. And even via LinkedIn, there's a lot of industry happenings that you can attend and you can take classes at an NYU or an organization called True or another organization called CTI.

There are ways to network through all of that. And I think, if someone listening, for example, wanted to get involved with theater, I'd be happy to have that conversation with anyone. Many producers in theater are happy to do that, because one of the things that I always say that as an investor, it's a crap shoot and you never know what's going to make money or not make money.

But the reality is if there were not investors, there would quite simply not be theater. If you love theater, this is the way to support it. And you don't necessarily have to be rich to be an investor. Yes, you do need to be accredited at a certain level because people in the industry want you to understand the risk that is involved.

But what I've said to my investors on shows, and I'm Tony nominated for Natasha, Pierre and The Great Comet of 1812, and all but one of my investors were first-time theater investors. And one of the things that I said to them is, "You know what, I can't promise what the end result will be of this because no one has a crystal ball. And if any producer ever guarantees you that you're going to get rich from it, run for the hills because you never know. But what I can promise you is that you're going to have an amazing time. And if theater speaks to you, then it's just a lovely experience, and you're supporting the arts."

Carol Fishman Cohen: Okay, so this is very interesting. So you're saying most of your investors are first-time investors and you don't have to be a super rich person to do this. Can you give us a sense of what the range of money is that people would invest in a particular show?

Robin Gorman Newman: It varies for a Broadway musical because they are higher capitalization. Typically, usually I would say the lowest amount would probably be $25,000. It's usually $25,000 or $50,000 but sometimes there is the opportunity to split, they call it a share. There is an opportunity to split a share. So if you had a friend for example, and if you were able to come in on the show with $25,000, you could split that with someone else and both do $12,500, and that's a little more palatable.

Depending on the show, that would typically get you into opening night. You would be part of, often, the first night opening preview of a show. There's a lot that happens around a show that makes it just so cool and exciting. And honestly, when you invest, at least my experience has been, that it feels like your show. And there's excitement around that.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Absolutely. Okay, so that's the big time Broadway shows. Is there another level for off-Broadway or different other kinds of productions?

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes, there would be. For example, I'm developing a show right now with my producing partner inspired by my book, How to Marry a Mensch, and we have in mind off-Broadway and regional, and we'd love to do London and Israel and all kinds of other places. We're open to Broadway, but we don't know if that will be the path and not every show has to be.

Because it's off-Broadway, it will be a much lower capitalization. I don't know exactly what, so I'm not sure what we would ask for from investors yet, because we haven't raised money just yet. But I think then yes, there probably would be the opportunity to come in lower potentially for something like that.

So off-Broadway is a great place to start. And actually the advantage of off-Broadway is that sometimes it goes to Broadway. If you have a desire to get to Broadway, the time to get involved is off-Broadway, because once they announce the Broadway transfer, it's too late. And also if a show has a trajectory of regional touring or regional production licensing, which we definitely have in mind for my show inspired by Mensch, you don't know where that will take you. A lot of shows, if they don't succeed in New York or it's just too competitive, they can't get a theater or what have you, then just regional touring can bring in a lot of money and even overseas productions as well.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Very interesting. This may, I don't know if this is the right question to ask or if it's too technical, are there funds that people can invest in that then in turn invest certain minimums in shows?

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes, I do know of a couple like that. They're usually fairly big-ticket with the amount of money you have to put in. For the smaller investor or the first time investor, that would not be very viable.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Okay. So the range is really more about, is it Broadway? Is it off-Broadway? Is it regional? And it looks like there are a range of ways that you can be an investor if you're going to get involved on that side of it.

So tell us a little bit more about Natasha, Pierre and The Great Comet of 1812, and then what you're doing right now with How to Marry a Mensch.

Robin Gorman Newman: Yeah. Natasha, Pierre was the most amazing experience. We got the most Tony noms that year and I became Tony nominated, which was unbelievable for my first Broadway producing gig out of the gate. To be at the Tony awards was quite surreal. I was in my element completely. And it was unexpected actually, because I was invited on by a producer who I had met through Sylvia, and I had made the decision after Sylvia that if I was going to invest or get further involved in a show to raise money, because a producer needs to raise money, I wanted my name on a Playbill. And to get my name into Playbill means that you have to be a producer.

So I just went for it, but I had never raised money before. And I had a very short window because Comet was a transfer, because it came from off-Broadway and then it was at ART in Massachusetts, and then it was coming very quickly to Broadway. I had maybe six months at the most, if that, to raise money, and that's not a long time.

So I was under a lot of pressure, but I hustled and I did it with a lot of sleepless nights, but it worked. So, perseverance, networking, belief in the project, for me, it was really heartfelt because, as I said earlier, you can't promise what the payback for a show will be, but if you can promise that someone will have a good time and you’ll do your best to make that happen. In my case, Josh Groban was the star and a number of my investors loved Josh Groban. So I promised them that I would make sure they got a chance to meet Josh. And I stood by that word and made it happen.

Carol Fishman Cohen: So tell us what's happening now, and what's happening with How to Marry a Mensch, and I think you're also working on a couple of other projects too, right?

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes. I'm on two other Broadway musicals that are in early development, and one of them was inspired by the TV show, The Nanny, and it's being written by Fran Drescher and her writing partner, her ex-husband who did The Nanny TV show with her, which is hugely exciting. And I think it'd be like the perfect thing for when "intermission" is over from the pandemic, because it's going to be like comfort food on stage, this show, it's just going to be fun and light and fluffy. And I think we're all going to want that coming out of this.

Then I'm also on a musical that's been written by Elvis Costello and Sarah Ruhl inspired by the iconic film A Face in the Crowd. They're both earmarked for Broadway. So those are coming, and then I'm working on my own musical with my producing partner, inspired by How to Marry a Mensch. And with that, our vision is really, we'd like to inspire a mensch movement.

We feel like we need all the mensches in the world that we can get now more than ever. And if we can get people to have a consciousness of how they're showing up in the world, and how that translates into the dating realm, then that's the messaging around the show that we hope for. Of course we don't want to be preachy and we just want it to be entertaining as well, it is a musical. But we do hope that we can inspire a dialogue and to get people to think about, are they living authentically and what are they putting out into the world that is actually doing some good?

Carol Fishman Cohen: And just for the people who may not know what mensch means, can you please define it for the audience?

Robin Gorman Newman: Sure. Mensch is a decent responsible, person. The origins are Yiddish, we're not perceiving this as a Jewish show. It's meant to be contemporary and reflect diversity and have different ages shown. We really want it to be a show of the times because dating has also become complicated, with all the dating apps now and zoom and all those things happening.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Not to mention the pandemic and COVID dates, whatever those might be.

Robin Gorman Newman: Exactly. We're not going to get heavy into COVID, but I think what's coming out of COVID is that I think people are doing a lot of self investigation or exploration as to what's really important at the end of the day.

Who do they want to be with? What love do they have in their lives? How would they like to see that going forward if things aren't showing up the way they wish they would?

Carol Fishman Cohen: And when you say, when you're the producer or the producing partner and you say, "We're working on it," what is your day like, what are you actually doing day to day?

Robin Gorman Newman: A lot of things, Carol, many balls in the air. Right now, we're in early development. So what that means is that we have our composer/lyricist, and he's Tony nominated, we're so excited. And we are talking to different book writers, so that's going to happen very shortly as well. So we're going to have a creative team. We already have our director. We already have our GM firm, and of course we have our attorney. So as soon as we get the book writer, which I'm hoping will be this month, potentially, then we'll be poised to have them start to write and ideas will fly and we'll be in the zoom room and brainstorming is going to go on, because my books are non-fiction.

So we need to create a narrative. And of course that will largely be between the book writer and the composer/lyricist. But since the source material is mine and my producing partner has lots of ideas too, we do plan to share, and with our director as well. Because you never know where a great idea is going to come from and musicals are so collaborative. So once we have our team, that's going to be the next step that we do. Then they'll go off and write. They usually have about six months to write a full script and then we go from there, which includes the music as well. Then we go from there and see what we need to do, does it need more work? And of course it needs more work because nothing happens overnight in theater, but we keep moving steadily forward. The positive thing is that because it's early development for us, we're really not going to be affected by this theater intermission right now.

Carol Fishman Cohen: I just thought of a bunch of questions while you were speaking, what is a GM firm? What does that stand for?

Robin Gorman Newman: Oh, that's general management. That's when you hire a firm that essentially overlooks the business aspect of the show. It just keeps all the paperwork and everything in order with an eye toward production and just all the various steps that it takes to produce something.

Carol Fishman Cohen: I see, like paying people and all that kind of thing. Or is that something separate?

Robin Gorman Newman: That's part of it too.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Got it. And when you say book writer, that's actually like the script, you're saying the narrative.

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes, exactly. Book writer, as in the term librettist, the person who writes the story for a musical.

Carol Fishman Cohen: And how typical is it for a musical to be developed around a nonfiction book, as opposed to fiction?

Robin Gorman Newman: I don't know if it's typical or not typical. I think inspiration comes from different places. And the directive that we have given is that the book is written by me as a love coach, which is the work that I do with singles. I offer private consultations.

And so we'd love to see a love coach onstage reflected in the book. Not me, I've given the mandate. I don't need to see me up there. I think it would be fun to see a love coach, but other than that, we're not wedded to the specific content of it. It's more the messaging around it, and the tone, there's a lot of narrative flexibility.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Okay. Interesting. Can you tell us about the New York Theater Barn? What is that and how are you involved with it?

Robin Gorman Newman: Sure. New York Theater Barn is a nonprofit organization that incubates new musicals and early development. And I came on their board during the pandemic and I just love what they do. They are providing a showcasing home for new works now that otherwise wouldn't have one. So they have a new musical series, which is free to attend. It's virtual and it's every other Wednesday. And people can sign up to get on their email list on their website, it's newyorktheaterbarn.org. They can also be found on Facebook. I do a live watch party, actually in my theater group on Facebook whenever this happens, which is a lot of fun and a great way to connect with people as well. They also do choreography labs, and they're launching a podcast. They actually did a really cool thing as well, they launched a record label under Broadway Records to produce concept albums during this time.

It's such an amazing platform because this, again, is intended for new musicals and early development. So what they are doing is giving a platform to creative artists at this time to share the new works that they're developing.

And I can tell you, Carol, one thing about the industry, Broadway, off-Broadway and off-off-Broadway will all come back. And when it comes back, it's going to be gangbusters because the rooms, the zoom rooms that I had been in, and the work that I have seen is breathtaking, some of it. So there's going to be a boatload to look forward to. And if anybody loves theater who's listening to this, I would urge you to tap into New York Theater Barn and just check out the virtual programs because it's an opportunity as well to be in the zoom room and to be part of, to witness the process of the early development of a show.

Carol Fishman Cohen: So much of what you're talking about, it's like there's an incubator, there's funding, it's a startup every time you create a new musical and a production and early concept. The idea that you have an incubator for theater, it feels like it's an offshoot of incubators in general.

Robin Gorman Newman: That's a great analogy, and you're exactly right, because each show tries to position itself as a business. There's commercial theater and then there's nonprofit theater, but lots of the nonprofits support shows that they hope will ultimately become commercial. The point is that what's important is to support these incubators, like the New York Theater Barns of the world and the other nonprofits, because no show starts on Broadway, and a lot of theater fans don't know that. The path is that it has to begin, it has to find a home somewhere to work out the kinks to try itself out, whether it's regional or overseas or off-off-Broadway. These places need to survive, and right now it's so vital to support them to the best of our ability.

Carol Fishman Cohen: All right. So I just want to repeat that no show starts on Broadway. They start in regional theater, overseas, off Broadway, off-off Broadway because, as you just said, you're working out the kinks. I guess you're also seeing what the audience appeal is and what you need to change to increase the audience appeal, and then from there, some of the shows will move to Broadway. Some, probably a very small percentage.

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes, that's true.

Carol Fishman Cohen: I see. Okay. We are winding up to the end and I am going to ask you that question about what's your prediction for what the theater world looks like post pandemic. You've given us a little bit of a preview with almost this sort of pent up demand that's building in the virtual world. And I love how you call this "the intermission." That's great language and it's great theater language.

Robin Gorman Newman: What do I see for the future? Wow, I don't have a crystal ball. I think, aside from the productions that, as I said, are going to be amazing, I think the virtual world that we've experienced during this time is not going to completely disappear. I think zoom has become a thing. I'm not saying that's going to become the thing at all with theater because it won't, nothing replaces live theater. But I think it will be interesting to see if there is some incorporation of that going forward. Because theater has always been one of those situations where not everyone can get to it, whether they can't afford it or they don't have access to it. So I think that will be something to keep an eye on and see if that winds up becoming a part of it.

And then you have so many platforms now where the creative work is coming from different places. During the pandemic, there's been some really cool stuff emerging from TikTok, so I think that people in the industry are going to be scouting talent and keeping an eye out in ways that they really hadn't before.

And that's been emerging during this time as well.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Like the democratization of trying out or auditioning?

Robin Gorman Newman: Yes, that too, for talents who are writing, actors and actresses who are auditioning. And there are other platforms that are launching to create virtual work or ways that people can connect with each other, and even post videos of themselves singing, or sharing some kind of talent that they have so they can be found. All of this is being developed right now and some of it already exists. And of course you have the streaming platforms Broadway HD, and Broadway On Demand who are both doing a great job, there's a lot of interesting content. Broadway Podcast Network launched and they have some amazing theater podcast shows. So I don't think any of this is going anywhere. I think the industry is just going to be amped up in a different way. I do think you're going to see more diversity in theater productions as well. And I do think that, initially, this'll be interesting to see what shows come back first, because it will be a little easier initially to do a show that's not a musical or at least that's a smaller musical. Because part of the challenge around the theater is the small dressing rooms, the tight orchestra pit, the tight backstage area.

So I think some of the productions that are a little smaller in stature and with Mensch, our musical for example, we have an eye toward no more than six actors, which was always our mandate. And the other thing is we're aiming for ninety to a hundred minutes, no intermission. And I think you're potentially going to see some shows, if they can when viable, taking a look at that format, because it's going to be preferable not to have people hanging out during an intermission in the lobby or the common spaces of a theater. That won't be ideal for a while until things get really, fully safe.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Wow, that's a lot of innovation. It came out of necessity, but interesting about what you think might stick and what might not and how the format of theater productions might evolve at least some of them as a result. So Robin, I want to end with the question that we ask all of our podcast guests, and that is, what is your best piece of advice for our relauncher audience even if it's something that we've already talked about today?

Robin Gorman Newman: One of the things that I learned so much, especially during my investor raise as a producer for A Great Comet, because it was new to me is, "no" is often just "no for now." And then of course, in that case, it related to some investors who initially said, "Oh, I don't know, the timing isn't right for me. I love it. I'm interested. Can you circle back?" And I did. And it wasn't right one month, but then three months later, they were on board. And in that case, that was for investing, but I have learned just in general for anything that you want to do, quite frankly, Carol, if you're just not getting the answer that you want, then maybe you're just not meant to do it right now, but it doesn't mean it's not meant to happen.

Carol Fishman Cohen: That is an excellent place to end and "no" only means "no for now" applies to so many aspects of relaunching. I also just want to say, this has been a fascinating look at how to get into the theater world at age forty. So you're setting an example for people who think that you have to be in it from a young age, and here you're showing that you actually don't, that there are ways you can get in your forties, and you're fully entrenched now.

Robin Gorman Newman: Oh yeah, it's never too late. I mean I don't think it's too late for a lot of things in life, but it's certainly never too late for theater. And I know people who've gotten into it even later than I have. And what's lovely about theater is that it's so communal and it really has the power to change your life, because you'll be in the room with people supporting projects you'll enjoy, but also making new friends. It has enriched my life in so many ways, and I'm so grateful for it. And to know that you're part of the arts and putting out theater into the world that can change lives, I truly believe that there's power in the messaging of theater. And to be part of that is beyond gratifying.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Wonderful. Robin, how can people find out more about your work?

Robin Gorman Newman: I have two websites, lovecoach.com and motherhoodlater, L A T E R.com. I don't have a dedicated theater website, but I'm happy to hear from anyone via those. And I can also be found on Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter and Instagram, but I'm mostly active on Facebook and LinkedIn.

Carol Fishman Cohen: Great. That's very generous of you. Robin, thank you so much for joining us today.

Robin Gorman Newman: It was my absolute pleasure, I hope that your listeners enjoyed and I hope you did as well, and thank you for the platform to share.

Carol Fishman Cohen: I enjoyed it so much, I know our audience will.

Thanks for listening to 3,2,1 iRelaunch, the podcast where we discuss strategies, advice, and success stories about returning to work after a career break.

I'm Carol Fishman Cohen, the CEO and co-founder of iRelaunch and your host. For more information on iRelaunch conferences and events, to sign up for our job board and access our return to work tools and resources, go to iRelaunch.com.

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Thanks for joining us.